Sandra Day O'Connor
I am very happy to welcome Arizona's first woman governor, Rose Mofford, to O'Connor House to have a conversation. I'm really pleased you could be here for this.
Rose Mofford
Now, I'm going to have preference today. Age before beauty today. I'd like–
Sandra Day O'Connor
I don't know, I think we're both in the age category. But I'm so glad you're here and I'll tell you one reason. You and I both grew up out in the hinterlands of Arizona. You grew up, you were born in Globe, Arizona, and went to school there. I was on a ranch over in Greenlee County, Arizona and Hidalgo County, New Mexico. And my parents sent me off to El Paso to go to school.
We were pretty far away from any school. So we both had rural Arizona upbringings.
Rose Mofford
And I'll tell you, that's the greatest thing that ever happened to me in my life. I was raised by two of the finest parents in the world.
Sandra Day O'Connor
That's great.
Rose Mofford
And I had, there were six of us, four girls and two boys. And we never lost track, but they all turned out, and I'm the last of the six.
Sandra Day O'Connor
You were the youngest.
Rose Mofford
I was the youngest. And I was "Baby Rose" to my mother until I was 50 years old.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Did she still call you "Baby Rose"?
Rose Mofford
Baby Rose. Now I'd like to tell you that I told several people I was coming out to be with you. And I told them how much fun we had when we were here before.Sandra Day O'Connor
That's right. Rose Mofford
And I said, "You know, I've got to ask Sandra what she takes, does she take vitamins?" She wrote a book.
Sandra Day O'Connor
I did. I've written several.
Rose Mofford
I know, that's what worries me, and I haven't started mine!
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well now, you have one wonderful book about your life.
Rose Mofford
I know, but I didn't write it. Polly Rosenbaum. She came from Colorado but she taught in Hayden, taught, I have so many stories about Polly. We were up in Globe one time. And she had been defeated after serving 49 years. And it was a very sad day, the people of Globe honored her. And the girl in the audience say, everybody got up and they have their accolades about Paul and everything. Yes. I said, we were going to write a book. And I said, I asked Polly, what shall we call it? I said, how about "100 Years in the Big House?"
Sandra Day O'Connor
(laughs) Like prison. Okay so what else?
Rose Mofford
So, she didn't like it. I said, "Two Heifers from Gila." Finally I said hallway. We gotta think of something. We'll call it "Two Girls from Globe." And she said why would we call it that? They'll think it's a best seller. They'll think for a couple of hookers down. They'll buy the book. And we were both quite old. That's pretty funny. And I have another story about that particular day. I'll never forget. Holly top school and hate Yes. And girl in the yellow they have stood and said, you know, Polly caught me chewing gum. And she made me write this poem 100 times a gum chewing girl. Cow chewing, cut. There is a difference somehow. It is the intelligent look on the face of the cow. And the girl was 50 years old. And she hasn't child chewed gum since.
Sandra Day O'Connor
That's fun. Well, my parents didn't want me to chew gum, I'll tell you. That's not anything I did as I grew up. I had wonderful parents, as did you. And I really appreciated them. They did a good job despite being out in the country without anything. Of course that was before the years of television, anybody, but we didn't have any of the normal connections. We didn't have a telephone line. We didn't have electricity, except from some little machine that my father would turn on for an hour or two at night. But we were pretty remote.
Rose Mofford
Well, I did learn a lot of things. When I was young, at Globe, I really got interested in water, mining, transportation and education. Now, I didn't start that when I was in kindergarten. But I followed that through until I got to Phoenix. Yes, 72 years ago,
Sandra Day O'Connor
Which makes perfect sense. Now. Why did you leave Globe? You had gone through school there, right?
Rose Mofford
I came down here to play ball. Just for–
Sandra Day O'Connor
See now, you were a big softball player, weren't you?
Rose Mofford
Not good, but–Sandra Day O'Connor
Oh, I heard you were! You were pretty good at anything.Rose Mofford
A lot better than I am today. But I wanted to tell you, coming down here was a great thing for me. Because I never forgot my roots. In appreciation, I'm trying to give back to Globe what Globe gave to me.Sandra Day O'Connor
That's good. Rose Mofford
The people there were wonderful. I'll never forget them. And I've said so many times, Sandra. My roots, my religion, my Rolodex and my records are my most valuable possessions, and I use them daily.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well that's good, I like it. Now, what did you do when you moved away from Globe and came to the big city in Phoenix.
Rose Mofford
I came down to work for Joe Hunt in the State Treasurer's Office. That's where I got my start.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And what did he have you doing, some little clerical job or did he give you a big deal?Rose Mofford
No, I was his secretary. I made $125 a month.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Wow, that was big time in those days.
Rose Mofford
And that's where I met some of the most wonderful people. Next door to us was Geraldine Swift, who I would never forget. She'd been very outstanding. The first governor there when I came was Sidney P. Osborn. And I met you when I was there because you served in the legislature. Sandra Day O'Connor
I did.Rose Mofford
And I've been asked more than one time, what is the best job you ever had?
Sandra Day O'Connor
And what do you answer to that question?
Rose Mofford
Secretary of State.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, it was a good job as it turned out. Because in Arizona typically, if a governor leaves office before the end of the governor's term, the Secretary of State is asked to be the governor, isn't that right?
Rose Mofford
Except you have to be elected to the office. That happened to me twice. Remember when Raul Castro left? I was appointed, and I could not become governor. And Bruce Babbitt became governor. And then this time, I got to be because I was elected Secretary of State.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes, because you had been elected Secretary of State.
Rose Mofford
But there was a lot of doubt whether I could serve. Our early constitution said that a female could not serve in the executive branch of government. That came up when I was appointed secretary of state, but I stayed there all those years.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Sure. Well, I think that kind of a provision would not be upheld under the US Constitution today, do you?Rose Mofford
No.Sandra Day O'Connor
I think that would be gone.Rose Mofford
They solved that when I got to be governor. It seems like the Supreme Court made that decision, they couldn't hold.
Sandra Day O'Connor
What happened then, after you became Secretary of State, eventually? You ended up becoming Governor,
Rose Mofford
Yes, that's the best job I ever had. Because you could help more people, you could serve as governor. There was many things you could do. And I worked with 12 of the 17 governors. And each one of them were very, very helpful. Those that were living, that helped me when I became governor. And I think the reason that we were so successful is because I listened to what they had to say. That was true in the legislature. We had friends we worked with, we filed their petitions, we kept them abreast of the laws.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, I think public officials at the state level need to pay attention to what the citizens have to say. They really do. Rose Mofford
Absolutely. Sandra Day O'Connor
The citizens have quite a bit to say these days, I think, because there's more coverage through television, of what public officials do and say than there used to be when you and I grew up. We didn't even have television out on the Lazy B ranch. We didn't have those things.
Rose Mofford
No, we didn't either. In fact, I have to say that my role model since I was a little girl was my mother. She died in 1970. She taught each and every one of us we had to help people. She had a garden. She did the laundry, helped the neighbors. If there was a funeral, she baked for them. And she taught us right from wrong.Sandra Day O'Connor
That's great. Well I think mothers are good for that.
Rose Mofford
My father was very strict. But he was a sports fan.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Is that how you got into sports? Because you were really good.
Rose Mofford
Well, I wasn't that good. I gotta be honest. But I learned my sports up in Globe. We played on a sandlot next to the Lutheran church. But I can well remember many a function that I've attended where people were born and raised in Globe, and I've played ball with them, but there's not very many of us left.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, perhaps not, but you earned a real reputation as a ballplayer.
Rose Mofford
I was going to ask you, you know there are people in your lives that keep coming back. And there's two people that have never been out of my life, so to speak. Bill Shover. And Eddie Basha. Bill Shover has helped me on many projects. When I was selected woman of the year, Bill Shover was behind it. I turned him down, but–
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, it was a good
selection. I applaud that.
Rose Mofford
And you were there the year before!Sandra Day O'Connor
How did you know Eddie Basha?Rose Mofford
He came forth when I had a fundraiser for charity. And every time I called, I can tell you many, many stories about Eddie Basha. And I loved all of his phone calls.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, he's a wonderful guy and has a good sense of humor. And I got to know him and his family well, because they had a cabin at Iron Springs, Arizona, where we had a cabin. And that's how I really got acquainted with Eddie and his family.
Rose Mofford
He's helped me on more charities than anybody that I've ever known. He's celebrated my birthday since I've been 75. Lavish party.
Sandra Day O'Connor
I thought perhaps Eddie would become governor of Arizona someday.
Rose Mofford
He was defeated, Symington won. But that's alright, there's no ill feeling. Sandra Day O'Connor
No, there shouldn't be.Rose Mofford
No, there never has been. I must tell you that Eddie Basha gets more people into trouble than anyone. He can–Sandra Day O'Connor
How so?Rose Mofford
He could disguise his voice. So if you ever get a funny call, beware–Sandra Day O'Connor
Beware. It might be Eddie Basha.Rose Mofford
One that got me, I got a call and he said, "This is Bishop O'Brien."Sandra Day O'Connor
(laughs) Oh dear.Rose Mofford
And I said, "The hell you say!" You know, thinking it was Eddie.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes. Rose Mofford
It was the bishop. And I've never lived it down, but the bishop and I remained friends.
Sandra Day O'Connor
How did the bishop react to that?Rose Mofford
Oh, he laughed. He knew. He's had, he told me I've had hundreds of calls from Eddie. So that went over well.
Sandra Day O'Connor
(laughs) That's pretty funny.
Rose Mofford
You've seen a lot of great changes since you came. When did you come to Phoenix?Sandra Day O'Connor
In 1957 My husband and I arrived in Phoenix. He had served in the military and gotten his discharge, and he had an opportunity to go to work as a lawyer at the Fennemore Craig law firm in Phoenix. Rose Mofford
Wonderful firm.Sandra Day O'Connor
And that's what brought the two of us here. Because although I'd grown up in Greenlee County, there weren't any lawyers over there, that wasn't a place to look. And it took the big city, Phoenix, to get us here. But it worked well. We loved it from the very first.
Rose Mofford
I remember when you served in the Senate. '69.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes. And I had some good years in the State Senate. I really did. It was wonderful.
Rose Mofford
That's why I liked the Secretary of State's office. That's where I met all the legislators.
Sandra Day O'Connor
We had to come file our papers with you, to serve!
Rose Mofford
That's right. And I remember asking Polly [Rosenbaum] when I wanted to know somebody in the legislature, she says, "You ask that young, sweet, Sandra O'Connor. She knows the law backwards and forwards." I remember Polly coming in to file her petitions one time. And the girl insisted that you fill it and you know, all those questions. Age: Polly put "legal."Sandra Day O'Connor
(laughs) Did they take the petition?
Rose Mofford
We took her petition. Everybody liked Polly. You know, I think that most of all of our successes were not by one person. I brag about the staffs that I had. We listened to their ideas, they were excellent. And I haven't lost track of them. Even to be in here today. Sandra Day O'Connor
That's good. Rose Mofford
It's a wonderful feeling.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes, it's great.
Rose Mofford
That's where my Rolodex comes in handy. Sandra Day O'Connor
That's nice.Rose Mofford
And I think the one thing that made me happy, have made a lot of other people happy. I take a lot of pictures, get them autographed and send them to the people. I have my museum that I thought was one of my greatest accomplishments. And I have a lot of memorabilia with a lot of good stories behind them. I divided them between Globe and Miami. And they've done a wonderful job.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And I'm sure it means a lot to the people who live there.
Rose Mofford
Now I want you to tell me about the the O'Connor house.
Sandra Day O'Connor
My husband and I wanted to live in an adobe house. I lived in one on the Lazy B Ranch, but it was plastered to protect it. We wanted to have sun-dried adobe that we could leave out, not plastered. And so we needed a great big roof to cover it up. And my husband and I helped paint it with adobe mud and scrape the joints. It was wonderful and we really loved it. It spoke to us of Arizona. The adobes were made out of the Salt River bed in Tempe, so it belongs.
Rose Mofford
Yes, it does. How did the, who started the, to bring it out here? How did it get started?
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, Barbara Barrett was one of the primary movers. We had to sell the house when I was appointed to the US Supreme Court. Housing in Washington, DC is very expensive, and we couldn't keep our house and move back there. So we had to sell it. And that was very sad. And the owner then had another job and he had to resell the house. And then someone else came along. And finally, it was owned by a bachelor who wanted to tear it down and build a big house. And that's when friends came and said, "We need to save the O'Connor Hous." And I said, "It can't be done, it's adobe." They said, "Well, we're going to do it." And they managed to have it moved, adobe by adobe. They had to pull it apart and carefully bring it out. And Tempe, under the mayor, decided to provide space in Papago Park to put it, and that's why it's here. And believe it or not, it got moved, adobe by adobe. And the roof and all.
Rose Mofford
It's a wonderful thing. Not only a tribute to you, your family, but to Arizona.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, I hope we can make good use of it here in Arizona, and I think we can. But I'm so glad you're part of it. You were the first woman governor. And we've since had several others. We've had three. And they've all been pretty successful, wouldn't you say? Rose Mofford
Yes. Sandra Day O'Connor
And we have a woman governor at present. So you set the pattern for them and showed that it could be done.
Rose Mofford
I worked well with all three. I've included them on my Christmas card. And that's my favorite holiday is Christmas. And I've been putting out my Christmas postcards for 35 years plus. And I take the event of the year.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Oh, you take a special event each year?
Rose Mofford
And make the card like that. I design it. I have a wonderful artist, a caricature type.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, what did you focus on last Christmas? What was the event that you wanted to focus on?
Rose Mofford
My hands.Sandra Day O'Connor
Your hands?!Rose Mofford
Yes. Sandra Day O'Connor
All right. Rose Mofford
You know, I'm a keeper of things. I'm a hoarder, maybe you might call it But I was looking through some old papers and found different committees that I've served on and how I got started and who were the people. I've followed law enforcement. That's one thing I've been very interested in, law enforcement. History, transportation, and military. Because when I left Globe in 1940, war clouds were hanging over. I did not go to the university. I was going to go to the University of Arizona. My folks couldn't afford it, but the mines gave a small sort of scholarship at that time, but I didn't go. And I've been reminded many times since that time–of course, he's not around anymore but [unintelligible] Johnson said, when I was in the secretary of state's office, I said, "I'd like to go back to college." He said, "You're too old."
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, I think you did just fine, college or no college. You've played a very important role in Arizona's history. Our first woman governor. Were you the first woman to serve as Secretary of State?
Rose Mofford
Yes.Sandra Day O'Connor
I thought so.Rose Mofford
I worked with Mr. Bolin for 25 years before I left to go to the Department of Revenue. And then I went back, I was appointed. And that's when–
Sandra Day O'Connor
Was Wes Bolin from Arizona, did he grow up here?
Rose Mofford
No, he was from Butler, Missouri, I think he was from. But he was a nice man to work for.Sandra Day O'Connor
Very nice.Rose Mofford
And that's why I say the Secretary of State's office was one of the best. You could keep every official informed on the laws.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And kind of supervise the election process for Arizona. Rose Mofford
That's it.Sandra Day O'Connor
That was a key, I think, and still does. It still does.
Rose Mofford
And still does. It's wonderful that you can help them.
Sandra Day O'Connor
You got involved with the Cactus League, didn't you? In baseball? Now tell us what the Cactus League is and what your role was with that.
Rose Mofford
It's bringing teams from all over to come to Arizona. But I appointed the committee. Once again I repeat, you don't do it alone. And I got the [unintelligible] with mayors of the cities, legislators and people to come forth.
Sandra Day O'Connor
The Cactus League includes what? What teams belong to that?
Rose Mofford
We have 14 teams now. And of course the Cubs, they just–
Sandra Day O'Connor
These are major league baseball teams.
Rose Mofford
Yes, they came here to train.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And then they're coming coming to Arizona in order to have spring training, right?
Rose Mofford
That's right.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And it's become a big thing in Arizona!
Rose Mofford
Yes it has, and I've seen where the Cubs just dedicated their park out there. I even went to China and Japan and all over the country to lobby to bring some of these teams in here.
Sandra Day O'Connor
That's great.
Rose Mofford
And the Japanese and the Chinese were very shocked when they saw me get out on the ball field.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well isn't it true that today most of those spring training games are now in Arizona?
Rose Mofford
Yes. Yeah.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And you really started that.
Rose Mofford
Well, I became governor and I appointed this committee. We donated money and got it started. A lot of wonderful people have been honored, a lot of good athletes have come out of Arizona. I've seen tremendous growth since I came here.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes. Why, haven't we all?
Rose Mofford
Yes. And I hope it continues, because it's brought a lot of money into Arizona.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes it has.
Rose Mofford
And softball has, too. Back when I, in 1939 we had the finest women's ball teams in Arizona. We had the BBS&W Rattlers, the Cantaloupe Queens that I played for.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Now who were the Cantaloupe Queens?
Rose Mofford
They were sponsored by the cantaloupe grove.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Women's softball players, right?
Rose Mofford
Yes. And that, imagine a girl from Globe going to the Madison Square Garden and playing ball.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And you played softball in Madison Square Garden as part of the cantaloupe team. That's great.
Rose Mofford
And we didn't have the money.
Sandra Day O'Connor
How did you do?
Rose Mofford
We did very well.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Good.
Rose Mofford
We played at the World's Fair in Chicago and beat the men.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Oh really! My goodness.
Rose Mofford
We traveled through 33 states, we drove.
Sandra Day O'Connor
That's great.
Rose Mofford
And we had a wonderful time.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, that's pretty impressive.
Rose Mofford
But they were all local girls. They were all Arizona girls.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Didn't we have a visit in Arizona from the Pope when you were governor? Is that right?
Rose Mofford
Yes. I must tell you that that was one of the happiest and memorable occasions in my life. And he was greeted everywhere. Everywhere he went, the crowds were enormous.
Sandra Day O'Connor
I'm sure.
Rose Mofford
He went to the hospitals. And I got to shake his hand when he got off the plane.
Sandra Day O'Connor
That's great.
Rose Mofford
And there was Evan Meacham. Myself. Dennis DeConcini.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And you were governor at the time.
Rose Mofford
That's right.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And were able to welcome him as governor of the state.
Rose Mofford
The next thing I'll never forget is Mother Teresa's visit.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Were you Governor when Mother Teresa came?
Rose Mofford
Yes. And I built a home here with the help of Monsignor and other people. When she came to town, it was something I'll never forget. She came down Washington Street. And people were standing there putting money, taking money out of their pockets, and I think it was something like $33,000 before she got to where she was going.
Sandra Day O'Connor
That's amazing. She has been incredible in her life. And she's about half your size, isn't she? Tiny little woman.
Rose Mofford
She was.
Sandra Day O'Connor
And think what she did.
Rose Mofford
When she came, we were going to have a function at the fairgrounds. The price of admission was food.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Yes, to bring food.
Rose Mofford
48 tons. What are you going to do with 48 tons? I called Basha's, Safeway, St. Vincent de Paul. And everybody delivered the food. 48 tons of food.
Sandra Day O'Connor
She made a real difference in the world, didn't she?
Rose Mofford
And in my purse, I have a rosary that she gave me. It's not flashy, but I cherish it.
Sandra Day O'Connor
But it means a lot coming from her, I think.
Rose Mofford
Yes, it does.
Sandra Day O'Connor
Well, I want to thank you, Governor Rose Mofford, for coming to O'Connor House and having a conversation. I love hearing from you. And I know that others will enjoy this as well.